Legislature(2007 - 2008)BUTROVICH 205

04/20/2007 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ SB 111 KODIAK NARROW CAPE PUBLIC USE AREA TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ HB 186 SPORT FISHING GUIDE RECORDS TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ SJR 4 NATURAL GAS FOR STATE RESIDENTS TELECONFERENCED
<Above Bill Hearing Canceled>
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
= SB 80 OIL & GAS PRODUCTION TAX: EXPENDITURES
Heard & Held
           CSHB 186(FSH)-SPORT FISHING GUIDE RECORDS                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:37:54 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR   HUGGINS   announced   CSHB   186(FSH)  to   be   up   for                                                               
consideration.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
TOM WRIGHT,  staff to Representative  Harris, sponsor of  HB 186,                                                               
said that it  makes minor amendments to AS  16.05.815 that allows                                                               
the ADF&G  to share  information about  sport fishing  guides for                                                               
law   enforcement  purposes   with  the   National  Oceanic   and                                                               
Atmospheric  Administration   (NOAA)  and  the   National  Marine                                                               
Fishery Service  (NMFS) and to the  International Pacific Halibut                                                               
Commission (IPHC).                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked the ADF&G  why this information needs  to be                                                               
shared.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
DOUGLAS  VINCENT-LANG,  Special  Projects, Alaska  Department  of                                                               
Fish and Game  (ADF&G), explained that the  allocation of halibut                                                               
has  been before  the North  Pacific  Fishery Management  Council                                                               
(NPFMC) recently and  one of the preferred  alternatives that was                                                               
favored  by charter  boat  operators is  having  an annual  limit                                                               
rather  than  a  one-fish  bag limit  or  instituting  even  more                                                               
restrictive measures  that would affect the  daily opportunity of                                                               
guided anglers to  catch fish. However after an  analysis, it was                                                               
found  that an  annual  limit could  not  be established  without                                                               
having  the  ability to  share  log  book information  with  NMFS                                                               
enforcement. The  only other way  to track an annual  limit would                                                               
be for charter boat operators to  have a state log book for state                                                               
managed  species as  well as  a  duplicate federal  log book  for                                                               
halibut. The Council and many  charter boat operators view annual                                                               
limits as  an opportunity, but  don't want to burden  the charter                                                               
boat operators  by requiring  a duplicate  log book  program. So,                                                               
they are now asking to allow  sharing of log book information for                                                               
enforcement purposes only with the  NMFS enforcement and with the                                                               
IPHC. The  shared information would remain  confidential with one                                                               
minor exception  - if  a violation actually  went to  court, that                                                               
piece of  information associated with the  violation would become                                                               
public. However this information  would still remain confidential                                                               
meaning that those confidential records could not be released.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:40:02 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR STEVENS  said he knows  a lot  of fishermen who  are very                                                               
concerned  about giving  out  information  and probably  wouldn't                                                               
tell their own mothers where  they caught halibut. How can people                                                               
be  assured that  this information  that is  shared with  federal                                                               
agencies is going to  be protected as much as it  was when it was                                                               
in state hands.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  VINCENT-LANG  replied  under   the  statue  the  information                                                               
remains   confidential  except   for  enforcement   purposes.  He                                                               
reminded  the  committee that  log  book  information is  already                                                               
shared for  the purposes of fishery  management plan development.                                                               
The only reason you would be fearful is if you have a violation.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:41:29 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WAGONER  asked what the  penalty would be  if information                                                               
gets out accidentally. Charter boat  operators are concerned that                                                               
this  information is  their client  list which  is how  they make                                                               
their living.  Competitors will do  bulk mailing to  their client                                                               
base and offer them a trip at  a reduced rate if they have access                                                               
to that information.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:43:44 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. VINCENT-LANG replied  that he didn't know  the exact penalty,                                                               
but it  wouldn't be any  different than the  penalties associated                                                               
with the  current sharing of  commercial fish  ticket information                                                               
with  NMFS  enforcement.  Commercial  fishermen  have  that  same                                                               
worry.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WAGONER  said  that commercial  fishermen  fish  a  much                                                               
larger geographic area  and guides have areas that  are much more                                                               
specific,  so this  information would  be much  more damaging  to                                                               
them.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG  said he would  get the penalty  information for                                                               
him.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
STEVEN DAUGHERTY, Department  of Law, said he was  looking for an                                                               
answer to that question.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS remarked  that it is very easy  to find information                                                               
about  anybody on  the Internet  and asked  what makes  him think                                                               
this information won't be able to be found there, too.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG replied that the  department has an MOU with the                                                               
federal government  saying it won't  release this  information if                                                               
it is not kept confidential.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked if  another course of  action could  get the                                                               
same results.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG  replied that the  other course of  action would                                                               
be  for  charter  boat  operators to  have  a  duplicate  federal                                                               
recording program.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:46:33 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HUGGINS asked  why the client base is germane  to where the                                                               
fish are caught.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG replied that the  past log book program included                                                               
summary harvest information  by trip, but the  Council needs good                                                               
harvest records  to develop quotas  and allocation  guidelines as                                                               
well  as  individual  fishery quota  systems  (IFQs).  To  assure                                                               
accurate  reporting,  the  Council started  recording  angler-by-                                                               
angler harvest and are sub-sampling those entries for accuracy.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS asked him to explain the moratorium.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG responded that  some people are confused because                                                               
the  NPFMC recently  adopted a  halibut sport  charter moratorium                                                               
and  entries in  these  log books  will be  used  to establish  a                                                               
management plan. Operators might be  confused about how this bill                                                               
would  affect  their  ability  to  enter  into  that  moratorium.                                                               
However, the  department can already  share information  with the                                                               
Council for  developing that management  plan. HB 186  will allow                                                               
enforceability once  the moratorium is  in place. So,  it doesn't                                                               
necessarily translate into the eligibility for the moratorium.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR STEDMAN asked  if there is any linkage  to potential IFQs                                                               
for the charter industry.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG  replied that the information  could potentially                                                               
be used  by the Council  in deciding on whether  to go to  an IFQ                                                               
system or  not, but this bill  doesn't get it any  closer to that                                                               
decision. He said that the state has a vote on the Council.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:49:38 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked if the  commissioner of ADF&G  supports this                                                               
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG answered yes.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HUGGINS  asked what  the boat operators  have to  say about                                                               
this issue.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  VINCENT-LANG  replied  that  he  has  talked  to  a  lot  of                                                               
different  boat  owners  who exhibited  uniform  support  for  an                                                               
annual  limit for  charter anglers.  However, everyone  was quite                                                               
shocked  when they  found  out that  state  log book  information                                                               
could not be shared with the  federal system and that a duplicate                                                               
federal reporting program  would have to be put  in place. That's                                                               
why the Halibut Commission adopted  the one-fish bag limit, which                                                               
is not the preferred alternative for the industry.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR STEDMAN  said the City  of Sitka has imposed  a surcharge                                                               
on export  of fish boxes because  of its concerns over  the large                                                               
amount  of product  being flown  out of  town and  the amount  of                                                               
product being  flow out  of town  with the same  name on  the 50-                                                               
pound  boxes. He  asked  if that  community  and possibly  others                                                               
could set up  systems that track the export of  fish to the ADF&G                                                               
so the different reporting could be cross-referenced.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  VINCENT-LANG   replied  that   wouldn't  be  part   of  this                                                               
legislation. He elaborated that Sitka  was worried about a couple                                                               
of different issues  when it adopted that export tax.  Part of it                                                               
was concern  over local user  conflicts, which the  department is                                                               
concerned about too  and it is looking at a  variety of different                                                               
mechanisms to address  - including the development  of local area                                                               
management plans. Sitka  has one of those plans, but  it needs to                                                               
be updated  - because  since the original  plan was  developed, a                                                               
subsistence  long-line fishery  has been  instituted in  the area                                                               
which needs to become a part of it.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:53:28 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR STEDMAN  said Sitka is  the first city to  institute this                                                               
kind of  surcharge and has more  concerns that a large  amount of                                                               
product goes unreported. He thought  the more cross reporting the                                                               
state  has, the  more  accurate the  information regulators  will                                                               
have.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG  replied that  is what  the Council  liked about                                                               
the annual  limit which is based  on how much fish  an individual                                                               
needs on an annual basis.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. DAUGHERTY found a partial  answer to penalties for disclosure                                                               
of confidential  information in 18USC19.05.  It said  they "shall                                                               
be fined  under this title  or imprisoned  for not more  than one                                                               
year or both and shall be  removed from office or employment." He                                                               
hadn't been able  to determine the fine, yet, but  he thought the                                                               
termination  of employment  and  imprisonment for  one year  were                                                               
fairly substantial  penalties and should be  sufficient to assure                                                               
a pretty high degree of confidentiality.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WAGONER said, "It sounds good to me."                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:56:34 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HUGGINS asked how this information is transmitted.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. VINCENT-LANG replied electronically  and only upon request to                                                               
the requesting person.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRS HUGGINS said they would set HB 186 aside.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:58:11 PM at ease 4:01:22 PM                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                

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